ok so I am really interested in this topic atm... and I would like to discuss about it if its ok with you guys.
Maybe some mods or admins can put some rules in here because I cant think of any at the moment...
srry 4 grammar and or any other mistakes im lazy.. 

so I am catholic, I was born catholic(parents and grand parents and so on are all catholic)
as you know we only believe in one god.


so I had a long time thinking about religion well mostly because my really really RELIGIOUS auntie wants to tell my other auntie to take me to church school. Now if I have a guardian in church school they can make choices for me so. Meaning I couldnt get out even if I wanted to, unless my guardian gave permission.
Church school is not real school its just learning about god and bible etc etc.. its about once or twice a month not so sure.. it used to be every 1 day of the week.. but I think they changed it due to money problems. not so sure lol...

I was really frustrated in the fact that my aunt was talking to my auntie about this without even telling me but who cares I over hear everything thing is... I started to think about religion like alot.
Man has created "gods" and religion since like forever.
Christianity got really big because most other god(s) where kind of expensive because you had to buy yourself into worthiness and acceptance which was expensive also you had to do sacrifices at times (roman times)
Christianity was simple
1 god,
accept god as your almighty savior and be accepted into heaven
and you are granted eternal afterlife as long as you believe in him and ask for forgiveness or blah blah...
and it was declined in the roman empire because Romans believed in multiple gods and Christianity only had a belief of 1 god and any other was pretty much "wrong"
Christians where pretty much punished made fun of etc, and it only kind of made them stronger in the second and 3rd century christian was very popular. it required no sacrifice no money, just your will of believing.
(I probably missed out alot but its what I can think on the top of my head currently reading about this in world history class)

anyway I have started to kind of doubts about if god is really real.
I dont see any proof. I go to a church and I just hear kind words out of some guy whos reading a highly modified modern bible lol.
I dont mean to offend anyone at all so dont take me wrong I am just telling you of how I am seeing it.

would I believe in god?
oh sure, I'd also believe in any other religion maybe even god(s)?
to bad.. there is no proof.
man has created religion and gods since the beginning of time and I really do not see any proof or anything. if words are proof then a angel kitty cat god must be true to.
just saying my side of what I think I dont really want to offend anyone. I would spend more time writing this but I am really lazy and sorry if some my words or sentences arent correct or make sense I don't like typing like a project or a essay unless I am doing a project or a essay.
make sense?


anyway admins/mods please apply rules to this thread because more than likely there will be tons of uh arguments maybe lol

anyway I kind of just want to talk to you guys about this. Feel free to ask questions and or any other stuff.
And btw.. if I where to die today, tommorow then it happens. I dont think its "faith" or "time to go you have been chosen" I just think #### happens what are you gonna do about it.
I also dont want to say I dont believe in god mostly because my family would probably like really try to persuade me and my grandma is pretty old and I would feel bad because she is a heavy church person and believer and I kind of dont want to let her down.




for the second or 3rd time.
man has created gods and religion to explain the unexplained. Like why are there stars in the sky. Or why and how the earth was made..
time didnt exist for the big bang or however the universe was created.. so there was no time so how could have god existed if there was no time at all. 
if you are interested in what I just kind of said then look at Stephen Hawkings 1 minute and 33 second explanation of why he doesnt believe in god.


I find this guy incredibly true somehow..
I mean I dont care if you do believe in god, thats fine everyone has the right to believe in their own religion.
I dont think there is a fate or anything like that. what happens.. happens.
Also if god made everything.. what was there before god?... how was god made?

now also a huge part of my argument is..
forcing children to believe in whatever religion you are.
I feel like children should have the chance to make the decision by themselves when they grow up.

1. X, Undelos. You have competition.
2. Oh, the joys of being Hylian.

hey if you believe in that, thats perfectly ok I dont see a reason why anyone else would have a problem.
but what do you mean undelos has competition?

Zeroknight wrote:

hey if you believe in that, thats perfectly ok I dont see a reason why anyone else would have a problem.
but what do you mean undelos has competition?

Yeah, I was bored one night, so I started believing in Hylia. And have you seen the length of your post?

lol yeah.. its pretty long O_O.
sorry guys xD
but I am really interested

It's cool, Zero, as long as no offensive language is used, you're free to express
your religious, political or whatever opinions.

Although I got an A* in GCSE R.E., I don't particularly enjoy it
completely and have not continued it in advanced levels (A Levels) and beyond.
But what helped me was how I could relate it to God arguments
and my beliefs.

I have problems structuring and organising my thoughts;
therefore I may not include all my ideas or may have to edit some in.

I am a deist. That means, I have no religion but I believe in God.
I believe God MAY not consider us in such ways that would
cause holy books to be made and profits to be assigned missions and such.
I just think we're too small and insignificant.

I will present my arguments but remember, they're only my opinions,
I may be right or wrong but I mean no offense and respect that everyone
has their beliefs (or not...you don't have to believe anything, you can just be passive, that's fine too).

Bacteria, viruses (assuming viruses they're living, thought they probably aren't). Will they go to Heaven?
It's difficult to imagine. Although probably only humans
have an afterlife according to most religions. Dunno.
I'm just saying, it's a bit odd if you think of it like that.
I think it's just evolution that made us be able to think so complexly compared to
animals.

Evolution: way too much evidence and sense to dismiss from a science perspective.

Why do I believe in God but don't do anything ritualistic?
Well, I just didn't like the style and lack of freedom.
E.g. going to church. I know you don't have to,
but for example, if you're a Christian, you do not necessarily HAVE to
go to church EVER but I'd rather not find guilt in a human ritualistic
foundation. (Human made in MY opinion. Whether God exists or not, humans made religion,
in my opinion. I don't think God directly influenced religion/worship.)

I assume most religious people are religious because
they were born into that culture.
What if you weren't? What, that means you're not holy or good enough?
That's just my argument. You can ignore me if you wish,
it's just my rational and critical assessment of such a topic.
It's things like some religions having animal-like depictions
and convenient stories and excuses and such,
that make me think 'religion looks fake to me'.
(E.g. angel wings must have been inspired from birds. Of course it can be argued
that us humans may not understand without some kind of metaphorical representation.
But that's up to you. Some think it's suspicious convenience and others think skeptics
are just cynical or don't have faith.)
Why are there no obvious profits these days?
What was it about hundreds/thousands of years ago
when holy books were first made, that cannot continue
to modern times?
And why must modern people trust the advice of what was said LOOONG ago?
Were we there when certain profits achieved great things or whatever the case?
How can we vouch for our ancestors' beliefs?
Wise people are not necessarily correct. They're just experienced and disciplined.
Their guess may not be better than yours.

We are only going on what someone said long ago that's been passed down
through culture. It's not necessarily wrong, but it doesn't encourage critical thinking.
Though that may not be important if religion is right.
And also the thing about there being many many many religions;
can we trust any of them if they all seem so different?
And some may be similar to others to conveniently seem to be consistent,
thus believable. Perhaps. Perhaps not.

Also arguments about why God allows suffering and stuff.
Well, clearly either he doesn't exist or it's not as simple
as depicted in stories and books and hearsay.

'Having faith': it sometimes makes me wonder if
according to some people, that those who don't
have faith in whatever, are insinuating we are not good enough
to trust God OR religion. I think that's unethical if that's the case.
But where did this faith come from?
Does it arrive with instinct or anything else biological?
Why would it come first when I can believe my fear
of dying or anything else that I have had from birth/early ages
and grew up with VS what someone claims is the right answer
and happens to be impossible to falsify. (Disprove/prove to be false;
you can prove God exists
but logically, you CANNOT prove he does NOT exist.
It's like trying to prove you DON'T have a certain particle in your house
that hasn't been discovered and cannot be detected with current scientific instruments/techniques.)

I bet I sound like an atheist. But I'm not. (Nothing wrong with that though.)
If you're interested in atheist humour (not suitable for children or easily offended religious people
that may not be able to take certain types of humour)
well I've seen some really funny (and clever) atheist humour videos on YouTube.
If you're open minded, those videos are funny. YouTube account is darkmatter... something, I forgot.

There's an argument that religion is just a means for humans not
to worry about death because of an afterlife.
I hope there is a Heaven, because a lack of consciousness,
or 'absence' or 'the camera going off' seems frightening.
Seeing black forever seems like the worst case scenario but
it's probably just like being in the deepest sleep forever.
Just not knowing anything, not thinking AT ALL, not existing,
which is not as bad but still depressing.

So ONE reason I choose to believe in God,
is because well, if you die and go to Heaven,
then great! You haven't disappointed the big boss upstairs, so to speak.
If you DON'T believe in God, you STILL have nothing to lose.
Imagine an atheist and Christian for example made a bet (not for money/no gambling)
for their beliefs:

-If God exists, the atheist MAY disappoint God. If he works that way.
But God is hopefully forgiving right? Hopefully. Or there is that devil thing...which I dunno....

-If God DOESN'T exist, (or technically rather the concept of an afterlife)
no one can laugh 'HAHA I WAS RIGHT!' at the other because
there is no consciousness for either of the two.
Everyone just loses in a way.

So in my opinion it's just better to have something to fall back
mentally to. Praying your life will be better won't necessarily
do anything, scientifically speaking. But it may help with your psychology.
Faith can bring motivation and confidence.

Also sometimes there are beautiful coincidences (and nasty ones...)
that make you wonder if there is something either supernatural
going on or if God operates in mysterious ways.
I personally don't believe the mysterious ways thing.
It just sounds like an excuse to be honest.
More likely it could just be a God vs the devil battle.
What do we know? Who are we to assume?
We can believe though. Ya know....if you want...

I'm sure I could make more points but...
I think the main ones are out of the way.
If I was religious, I'd be Christian, mostly because
it would fit me, culturally, more so than most other religions.
I'm a man child of science!
But for the reasons mentioned (plus more)
I believe in God but don't have a religion.
I think religion is just made by humans.
Is believing just some kinda game?
The ones who don't believe are sinners?
The ones who do, win.
C'mon! (I sound like I'm contradicting myself but this is just a hypothetical logical argument
to think about. And I'm referring to religion, not God.)

There have been absurd things written in holy books.
Those may or may not have been the writings of corrupted modifiers (or the way
some good people were raised culturally)
or they may just be human inventions.
But at least religion can sometimes make people better,
by teaching ethical guidelines. Others abuse it however,
making religion an excuse for terrorism or political arguments and changes, or whatever.

I may sometimes pray. But it's not a regular thing.
It's only for times of desperation or psychological assurance and wellbeing and hope.
But religious ties with me have loosened as I feel as though
I've been let down when I prayed for someone
who meant a great deal to me, who passed away.
I don't know if it was God's doing. I just feel
helpless and that prayer isn't something I trust much any more.
Questions of destiny arise and I start thinking,
'What so...the people who died in the last millions of years...
they were collateral damage to 'destiny'?'
Know what I mean?

So to summarise, I believe God may exist but he probably
doesn't care for us in the same way some people say.
For all we know, God may be a scientist and we might be part of a universe
or petri dish....

Who knows.

Zero, remember when I said X and Undelos might have competition? Forget it.

And at least Hylia thought of a way for people's wishes to come to when she's not around. Even though she's in every game.

Then again, even I admit the Triforce isn't real. On Earth anyway. Again, I'm only Hylian for fun.

And yeah, even though I'm mostly atheist, even I admit God has to exist in some way or another. Whether it's how we know him (with a few exceptions) or as a Celestialsapien. We may never know...

Don't believe in one.

Dont believe in one but i cant disprove that there can be one that excites so if i get proof that there is one them il believe but till then nope

I'm Weak agnostic.

Basically I don't believe in anything NOW, but if proof comes, then I will believe. (I'm pretty sure Weak agnostic is the name of it).


So same as Dot.

Well now I know thAt I'm not alone on here

Just gonna say that me and my family have had a kind of history with
strange things going on that make you think...
maybe there's something going on here after all.
Or it could just be psychological/coincidence.
Things like dreams having meaning/predicting successfully
and visions of Jesus (I think despite never seeing a depiction
of him before at the time if I heard correctly) and probably other stuff I haven't been told yet.

So I don't completely dismiss everything.
Perhaps Jesus did exist. We'll probably never know.
Don't think there's much physical evidence left.

I like to keep an open mind.
But I just don't like being told what to do by
a lifestyle created by humans. (Religion.)
If God went directly to me and told me he exists + other stuff,
I would definitely believe in whatever he says but I'd
question if I was under some kind of psychological effects
UNLESS it was OBVIOUS I wasn't.
Like if you could tell you are awake and suddenly you find yourself
talking to God or something.
I mostly eat healthily-ish and don't even drink coffee (contains significant amounts of caffeine and stuff)
so I think there's no way I'd have hallucinations
other than if I had a severe lack of sleep (more so than usual lol....darn insomnia...)
or if my water has been spiked...lol.

So yeah, it's probably not that simple, otherwise I think
if God does exist, it would be easier to let all humans know
of his presence and fix all the bad people.
(And the badness is all/most good people.)

XLR8 147 wrote:

Things like dreams having meaning/predicting successfully

Oh yeah, my mother had a dream about her grandmother the day before she passed away.

@Grumpy, something similar to that happened in my family too.

I think when I was little, my mum had a dream that I died. Or something like that.

Strangest dreams I had were that one where I dreamt I married my crush, and that one where I married another friend of mine and I was turning into Link. Nothing about death that I remember.

My idea of a decent afterlife: pretty much normal life. But better.

Hannah works in mysterious ways.

so I have officially decided to make a new religion called awesome pwners
there is one god.
only 1
and he is called the ultimate pwner
when u die
u pwn noobs
any followers
plz
u can follow  4 free and believe in him and give him ur spirit after life for eternal life ok ok
lol jk

but yeah good points all

Zeroknight wrote:

so I have officially decided to make a new religion called awesome pwners
there is one god.
only 1
and he is called the ultimate pwner
when u die
u pwn noobs
any followers
plz
u can follow  4 free and believe in him and give him ur spirit after life for eternal life ok ok

You got a follower!

Lol, kidding. xD

I had to make my own religion in freshman year....

There were five gods...
(we were studying greek mythology)

Goddess of earth, goddess of darkness, god of death, god of water... and there was another one

I had to write 2 legends and a creation story...
It was pretty cool...



OKAY
Well i love talking about this!!!
So let's see how i do using a tablet...

Kay,
Well i personally think my religion is BOSS hahahahha
I'm mormon, as a lot of you know,
The proper name is the church of jesus christ of latter day saints.

So.
I love hearing about other people's relgions ^.^ or just beliefs...

Because it's interesting, because heck, none of us really know what we're talking about! We'll find out later! Which is awesome! So we can just do our best

in my opinion, what ISN'T proof?
The earth was made in such a way that humans would survive...
(i dunno how, but it was)
People can be happy and people can be sad
(isn't that mind blowing?)
I had a D in a class, and my parents were going to check my grades that day, imprayed, and it was an A
(seriously... isn't that freaking awesome????)
My sisters car broke down once, and we were trying to make it to a gas statíon, and the freeway exit ramp was uphill, and we made it the whole way up IN NUETRAL!!! That's not physically possible.

So why not believe?
When you realize, there is no such thing as chance... you see everything so clearly.
Either God is helping you, where you did all that you could
Or it is just a consequence of an action...
And if you realize that the afterlife after this, for everyone is AT LEAST 10x better than earth... then diseases and fatal issues, really are a blessing to those that it's given...

I dunno, it's still hard though
But this life is soooo short...
And the wonders that are in store are soooo great!



I mean, i go to church every sunday for 3 hours
Every day before school i go to a seminary at 6am
Once a week i go to youth group
I don't swear, i don't drink, i don't do drugs.
It's not that i CAN'T but that i WON'T


I think, the most important thing we can do is be the best we can be.

We need to realize that life isn't about us
And that we should live our life that way.

I think that if we all genuinely try to do good in our life,
What will we have to loose?

If we try to do good, it won't matter whether we believe in god or not, and it won't matter whether there is anything after this life...

Because if there is,
GREAT you would have aced the mortal world...

And if not...
GREAT! You made other peoples lifes worth living

true, but sadly religion causes permanent brain damage...
also if there was a good imo he would have made everything perfect.
just because some person made a mistake by eating a apple from a tree.. means the whole world is doomed and everyone will suffer.
because believe it or not we are suffering maybe unless you got 2 billion buckaroos and just are living the life.
but other wise then that you got to work if he was real he would have made everything perfect.
he is god right?
I mean he has the power to just change everybodys mind if he wanted to
but he doesnt? to see what we do? well no duh we will do stupid stuff, we are inbred morons compared to "god" the almighty supernatural being

Zeroknight wrote:

also if there was a good imo he would have made everything perfect.

Well idk about that lol.


When you write a book, you make bad things happen to the protagonists and most of the time it usually has a good ending.

Ooooh i see i see


Well in my religion we believe in a pre-mortal existence

There, there was a great war.
(i know this sounds made up, but that's just because i can't give it justice)
It wasn't like a war with weapons, because we were only spirits.

God gathered us together and together we decided to come to an "earth life" to gain a body. He knew, that since we had our free agency, we could need a choice to be made about how we would come back to live with heavenly father again.
(A) Jesus Christ stepped forward and said "father, thy will be done, and the glory be thine forever."
Lucifer also stepped up with a different option. "behold, here am i, send me, i will be thy son, and i will redeem ALL mankind, that one soul shall not be lost, and surely i will do it; wherefore give me thine honor"

So that second one sounds great right? Well God cared so much about us, that he wanted to make sure that NO MATTER WHAT we would have the ability to choose. He didn't want to control us, he wants us to learn and grow, and become as great or even greater than he himself.

Lucifer is better known as satan. After that great war, people argued over which plan was better.
In the end 1/3 of all the souls that were created, followed satan as he was cast off for trying to revoke the literal "god given rights". They followed him to "outer darkness" (you all know the other term for it) and they never got a body.

The other 2/3s of the souls that were left, have/are/will be getting bodies.

Everyone here on earth chose to be here, and we knew the consequences.
We knew that we were here for a test. To see if we could make it back home. Plus we would learn more here than we ever would if all the answers were fed to us.

We are learning how to fish, and so we will never starve.

Plus, i've come to realize that, for instance, i wasn't this super serious/holy angel or whatever before i came here. I was exactly the way i am. This has been my personality all along. WHICH IS SUPER AWESOME! Haha


Also, about adam and eve, technically their sin was a plan. In the garden of eden, they were in the constant presence of god. They were told to "multiply and replenish the earth"   BUT in the garden they were completely innocent. If they did not eat of the fruit, they would still be alive, because they weren't actually mortal in the garden... AND they wouldn't have any children. If they stayed in the garden they would have been breaking THE OTHER commandment they were given by god.

Man must be punished for their own sins. And NOT for adam's transgressions.

They did no wrong, really. They were merely human.



Also, brain damage?
Religion has been around forever, it is people's comfort, technically there's no harm in believing it... we are driven to find something bigger than us... why? Maybe because THERE is something?

If not a God... then there are at least the other people in the world.
Maybe people just need to start believing in other people more?


And then to your comment about being less than god...

You are incredible right.
And you know what?

We are less than dirt.

Because at least dirt does what god tells us to do.

We constantly get promptings, "don't do that" or "do this" and then you realize that if you did it would save you loads of heartache, or even "don't go that way"

Stuff like that happens all the time

We just don't listen.

CS Lewis said, "Imagine yourself as a living house. God comes in to rebuild that house. At first, perhaps, you can understand what He is doing. He is getting the drains right and stopping the leaks in the roof and so on; you knew that those jobs needed doing and so you are not surprised. But presently He starts knocking the house about in a way that hurts abominably and does not seem to make any sense. What on earth is He up to? The explanation is that He is building quite a different house from the one you thought of - throwing out a new wing here, putting on an extra floor there, running up towers, making courtyards. You thought you were being made into a decent little cottage: but He is building a palace. He intends to come and live in it Himself.”

(B):

Links:
A) https://www.lds.org/scriptures/pgp/moses/4?lang=eng (read verses 1-4)
B) https://www.lds.org/general-conference/2011/04/as-many-as-i-love-i-rebuke-and-chasten?lang=eng&query=gardner+here



I love talking about this!!!

I mean, as hannah said, about how easily it is made up...
It's completely true

But! I do believe that what i have studied all my life is true. I really do.

But let's shoot hypothetically, and that it isn't... i'm wrong...

I'm still happy i believed what i did, because i try my hardest to be the best person i can be.
I may epically fail...
But at least on my deathbed i can know that i tried  i have nothing to lose, and everything to gain!

With Hylian... well... I'll just show you this instead: